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diveready - Currently Nova Scotia Canada 

Looking for Dive Buddies About Me:  I absolutely love diving! It doesn´t matter where - all seasons, all temperatures. It is an underworld museum, amazing marine life, calm and peaceful or a rush with a good current drift dive.
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Female
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my computer - a cheap one right now, it works.
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scuba diving, snorkeling, kayaking, walking
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scuba diving, the great outdoors, renovating my house.
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diveready's Dive Slate

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You need to reread my original post, as I updated it with some added valuable info - esp as to 1 big NO NO, etc. The message slate thing was messing up earlier (royally), so I hope it finally got posted. You still haven´t posted what kind of camera & housing he has so again - I´m just guessing as to the fogging problem. It would be the same scenario as if you went to see your DR and he asked you were it hurts, and you answered him back saying - ´´It hurts all over and everywhere´´, and then the DR would say - ´´Could you please be a little more specific.´´ Much like that same scenario - ´´what works for one person may not work for another´´ - as there are way too many variables involved (such as different metals, plastics, acrylics, etc etc) that have now all come into close contact with each other beings they are now all in the same tight little air space inside the housing itself. Bet you didn´t realize that ALL ´´plastics´´ will leach out (oil derived) vapors - esp when they are brand new!? How many brand new cameras have plastic parts on or inside them? Almost all of them! Studies have found that endocrine disruptors can leach out of plastics made from petroleum oil - that is a well known fact. Living 24/7 in a brand new car may not be the kool thing to do - even if you are homeless - hahaha. So when asking about using a bit of liquid ´´defog´´ inside the housing - ask yourself that same ? above - as related to a new car, or the different metals, plastics, acrylics, etc e ... (read more)
You need to reread my original post, as I updated it with some added valuable info - esp as to 1 big NO NO, etc. The message slate thing was messing up earlier (royally), so I hope it finally got posted. You still haven´t posted what kind of camera & housing he has so again - I´m just guessing as to the fogging problem. It would be the same scenario as if you went to see your DR and he asked you were it hurts, and you answered him back saying - ´´It hurts all over and everywhere´´, and then the DR would say - ´´Could you please be a little more specific.´´ Much like that same scenario - ´´what works for one person may not work for another´´ - as there are way too many variables involved (such as different metals, plastics, acrylics, etc etc) that have now all come into close contact with each other beings they are now all in the same tight little air space inside the housing itself. Bet you didn´t realize that ALL ´´plastics´´ will leach out (oil derived) vapors - esp when they are brand new!? How many brand new cameras have plastic parts on or inside them? Almost all of them! Studies have found that endocrine disruptors can leach out of plastics made from petroleum oil - that is a well known fact. Living 24/7 in a brand new car may not be the kool thing to do - even if you are homeless - hahaha. So when asking about using a bit of liquid ´´defog´´ inside the housing - ask yourself that same ? above - as related to a new car, or the different metals, plastics, acrylics, etc etc inside the housing with or without the camera fitted inside. Better yet - ask yourself if ALL liquid defoggers are created equal. Of course the answer is - you guessed it - a big fat NO! I tried several that were out at the time some 30 years ago, and never really found one that worked 100% - same as with snow skiing at altitude, and trying to find a ski goggle defogger that worked 100% of the time in all weather climate conditions & temps, and at every altitude. It just doesn´t exist! If it did I think every diver would have a/the same bottle in his/her dive box (PLANO fishing tackle type) like I had made up 30+ years ago to hold all my spare repair parts, spare batts, log books, dive Meds, etc etc. That age old test proven 100% defogger that we all use/used inside our dive masks years ago - guess what - it still works 100% effective today!! Best part about it is that it is totally FREE, and in great abundance anytime - anywhere - anyplace! You know - good ole everyday SPIT - the GOOD STUFF! Worked from day 1 of my NAUI dive Cert class to present day, so why change a good thing now I always say. Of course it wouldn´t work very well/good inside a camera housing for obvious reasons, so that´s where testing comes into play until you find something that works for your specific setup. If you ever watched the True U/W Film/Camera Professionals like the Cousteau Team put together their Film/Camera systems before a dive you would be truly amazed! I had the pleasure of touring the Alcyone early on in my diving career just shortly after her Maiden voyage in the mid 80´s when she was off the coast of CA doing a world tour, and then stopping all along the Pacific Coast to meet & great those that had made $$$$ contributions to the Society towards the building of the Alcyone - myself included. It was truly something memorable to behold, and have the privilege of stepping aboard and meeting Jean-Michel Cousteau in person. If only I could have met Jacques Cousteau in person that day then I truly would have felt like being amongst the ´´Gods of the Ocean´´ as it were!! At the same time he was on the Calypso (HIS baby), and was on his own expedition somewhere in the Atlantic Ocean if memory has me correct. At least I got to see the Alcyone equipment repair room, which was like the Heart of the vessel. That is where the Film (movie) cameras were being repaired and prepped, as well as the 35mm types with their various housings. Monster stuff back then as compared to todays downsized counterparts. What a busy little room that was! Too many memories so little space here. Anyway - SO - What happens to those (oil derived) vapors once they´re inside the camera housing? Simple - they are trapped! There is no VENT system once underwater, nor is there one when you are topside somewhere (hopefully in a dry environment), and your camera & housing have already been prepared (and sealed up at 1 atmo pressure or 14.7 psi I might add) long before you even hit your dive destination. Why the big fuss about vapors? Well - like everything else Physics wise out there in the real world they´re made up out of the same molecules that we come into contact with day in and day out. The things we touch prior to putting those supposedly ´´clean´´ cameras into those supposedly ´´clean´´ housings, and everything else inbetween. Then there´s the body oils we have naturally on our skin - not to mention all that SALT molecules in the air that are everywhere when doing Ocean diving. Then add a single drop of sweat to the equation - that which may just happen to get into the housing, or on the camera itself just before it gets finally sealed together, and what do you thing you have just done to help introduce molecules of contaminates to the inside the housing? Case closed as it were (pun intended). To prove my point - How many of you diehard Photo divers actually use latex gloves when prepping your camera & housing? I doubt there are many at all. Biggest excuse - they cost too much, or I´m allergic to latex. Then there´s still some more things you may never have even considered, or even thought about concerning your camera´s battery system - as it pertains to off-gassing (vapors) - esp when charging up those rechargeable camera batts just prior to doing another photo dive. Even Li-ion batts will off-gas and get very very WARM - esp if they are rapidly charged with some CHEAP batt chargers that are not properly designed to start with. Same goes for NI-MH batts as well, as some older digi-cameras will take 2 or 4 ´AA´ type hi-capacity (2500ma) NI-MH type batts such as those used in my older Olympus C-740, and those NI-MH batts will off-gas as well from getting Warm to Hot from recharging them. If those Warm/Hot batts are installed in your digi-camera just before sealing the housing up then you yourself have just introduced yet another reason for fogging once that overly warm camera/housing hits the cooler/cold water. Using the internal camera flash excessively just adds more HEAT to the inside of the housing (if it´s a compact Point and Shoot type) - as I said prior. Sealed lead acid batt packs - like those found on the custom High-end Pro setups - present even more vapor problems with off-gassing - esp after those type batts are recharged, and even greater care has to be taken because this time it´s in the form of Hydrogen gas, which btw can be very corrosive in and by itself esp when contacting certain metal & acrylic parts, and even some exotic metals. This I knew all too well from my military days working on ASW warfare plane systems. Though a lot of the above info/tips I laid out seems like it may be overkill, and maybe being way too overcautious, it´s just there for Food for Thought thinking, as it´s always the little stuff that kills a great dive!! Oh ya, and btw - did I mention to check for loose hairs stuck inside the housing between the O-ring seals. OK OK - I think you get the PICTURE now - hahaha - pun intended. Happy diving :~)  (read less)
 
Written by outtosea2 on 7/27/2010
Wow! I guess I will need to get more info.
Written by diveready on 7/27/2010
Happened to see your message post ? regarding camera fogging, and I had a couple of ??´s for you because your message post was a bit confusing the way you wrote it - from an under-h2o diving perspective that is. You used the same letter reference F as for the (Air Temp) as you did for the (Depth), so were you talking about the Depth being 43°F Degrees Fahrenheit (Temp wise), or was it 43 feet Deep (Depth wise) - as in using the ´ sign? You see why your written statement looks a bit confusing? Nova Scotia, Canada water can be quite cold year round I would imagine (with water temps down to 40°F or slightly lower not being uncommon at all). Same as like that with Winter diving in the Channel Islands, CA waters where Winter h2o temps like 50-55°F are quite common, and btw where I once yearly wetsuit dove years ago before moving to the year-round warm waters of FL, and those of the rest of the Caribbean dive spots as well. With warmer ocean water diving and u/w photography also comes a new set of potential camera/housing fogging problems all of their own. Mainly from saltwater HUMIDITY, or Humidity in general even when diving inland in freshwater conditions! You also didn´t mention what model camera & housing your diving buddy there has? Is it the camera (lens) itself that is fogging up, or is it the u/w housing lens port? If either/or is the case then you need to follow predive camera/housing guidelines set for both, and which can be found anywhere doing a good Google search onli ... (read more)
Happened to see your message post ? regarding camera fogging, and I had a couple of ??´s for you because your message post was a bit confusing the way you wrote it - from an under-h2o diving perspective that is. You used the same letter reference F as for the (Air Temp) as you did for the (Depth), so were you talking about the Depth being 43°F Degrees Fahrenheit (Temp wise), or was it 43 feet Deep (Depth wise) - as in using the ´ sign? You see why your written statement looks a bit confusing? Nova Scotia, Canada water can be quite cold year round I would imagine (with water temps down to 40°F or slightly lower not being uncommon at all). Same as like that with Winter diving in the Channel Islands, CA waters where Winter h2o temps like 50-55°F are quite common, and btw where I once yearly wetsuit dove years ago before moving to the year-round warm waters of FL, and those of the rest of the Caribbean dive spots as well. With warmer ocean water diving and u/w photography also comes a new set of potential camera/housing fogging problems all of their own. Mainly from saltwater HUMIDITY, or Humidity in general even when diving inland in freshwater conditions! You also didn´t mention what model camera & housing your diving buddy there has? Is it the camera (lens) itself that is fogging up, or is it the u/w housing lens port? If either/or is the case then you need to follow predive camera/housing guidelines set for both, and which can be found anywhere doing a good Google search online of the same. If you still are unsure of what is proper for both your camera and the u/w housing then go directly to the camera and/or the Mfr themseves, and talk with one of their LAB TESTING Engineers, and they will give you the straight poop on what is RIGHT and what is WRONG, and what is BEST! (Not like someone here in comment post saying that they put their Desiccant packs in the Freezer of all places - as in TONS of moisture present there! - and in a supposedly ´´vacuum sealed Ziplock bag´´ of all things - with all the supposed air ´´squeezed out´´ - get serious - still ROTFLMAO on that one - as all Ziplock bag plastic is made of SEMI-PERMEABLE membrane material to start with if you didn´t know that - it takes all kinds!). Having dealt with SEMI-PERMEABLE membranes for over 20+ years of Bldg Consulting work I´m not even going to argue that point, as it´s a NO-BRAINER! If the supposed Mfr´s don´t know what´s Right - Wrong or Best then I wouldn´t buy anything further from them - as pertaining to cameras or housings, as some Mfr´s are indeed true Mfr´s, and then again there are those that just claim to be, and are nothing more than aftermarket RESELLERS!! Big difference! That is why I love Olympus so much - even from my Bio-Medical days of working in a Major Hospital Bio-Med Dept. Their GI LAB equipment for one was 2nd to NONE - still is for that matter!! Optics and everything else they make as well. Talk about anti-fogging from a GI LAB standpoint - there it´s of a MAJOR concern - not going into any real gross details as it were. And when it comes to cameras (digital or otherwise) - they are in a league all their own. Their Repair Service Dept is EXCELLENT!! There can be many reasons why either/or are fogging, but not knowing more specifics would just be guesswork. By that I mean - if it´s a full on ´´high-end´´ DSLR camera & housing setup, or is it just a compact digi-camera & compact housing setup? Big difference in both cameras & housings in both cases - as related to the internal housing deadspace inside! How is the camera & housing prepared right before the dive? How about right after the dive as well? Also - what care is being taken inbetween dives (if multi dives are logged for that day)? This predive preparation part is probably the most important - as any little ´´skipped´´ attention to detail will no doubt come back to bite you underwater! Just as important are the TYPE of Desiccant (correct spelling btw) Packs you are using? Why? Just because it says Silica Pack on it doesn´t always mean it´s the right type for your camera housing. Manufacturers fill desiccant bags with a range of different materials. ALSO - Temperature is an important factor in deciding which type of desiccant to use. All desiccants have a specific temperature threshold, beyond which point they actually begin to release moisture back into the air, or in this case - back into your camera housing! Many a diver will use what they call a ´´rechargeable desiccant pack(s)´´, and then reuse them after a trip to the ´´Nuker´´ - VERY BAD IDEA, as nothing is a given when it comes to diving! Reusing any desiccant pack just because it looks ´´still OK´´ is a big gamble to take with a $1000+ camera/housing setup over a $1 desiccant pack. Just not worth it. Also of major concern is where the main heat source is on your digi-camera. If you are using a built-in camera flash and taking a lot of photos then it´s (flash heat) is even more pronounced. See why there are so many variables involved here when talking about fogging? Without knowing specifics which you are asking about - one can only guess. If you want to be more specific then maybe the fogging problem can be more narrowed down.  (read less)
 
Written by outtosea2 on 7/27/2010
LOL. By the way thanks for the welcome. I do have a question. One dive buddy has an underwater camera which keeps fogging up. He has dessicant in the case. By the way air temp is 80F and depth is 43F.
Written by diveready on 7/24/2010
 (2)
(Show Responses)
I was wondering if he could use a bit of defog. I will let him know all the info both of you have given me. I can hardly wait to get my own camera!
Written by diveready on 7/27/2010
Out2sea was pretty thorough there, but in short the 2 things I tend to try are 1) new moisture munchers or 2) a bit of defog on the inside of the housing or on the camera lens making sure to buff it clear again with a soft cloth. Usually that solves the problem for me. Your moisture munchers can look new but be on the verge of being used up if they aren´t kept in a sealed zip-lock back with the air all squeezed out. I like to keep mine in the freezer when not in my camera.
Written by whoelsebutbob on 7/27/2010
Oh no! I would never leave a tank standing unattended! I am on a charter in the St Lawrence River and that tank is bungy corded to the boat!!! LOL!
Written by diveready on 7/24/2010
1 response. 
(Show Responses)
LOL too funny. I guess I can see it after all, with a closer look. :)
Written by whoelsebutbob on 7/24/2010
Is that a tank I see standing on end, unattended in the background there? :) tsk... tsk... kidding! Welcome to the Dive Slates!!! Feel free to let us know if there´s anything we can do or answre for you.
Written by whoelsebutbob on 7/23/2010

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